Timing, How Do You Know?

Discussion in 'Ford, Lincoln and Mercury' started by Lightning2002, Dec 19, 2015.

  1. Lightning2002

    Other than blowing up your engine, lol, how do you know how advanced you can set timing? Obviously if you hear pinging there is too much but that's running a risk. Does the knock sensor pick up on ping enough to use it to datalog and setup timing if you tune yourself? What do you log and how to you interpret it?
     
    Lightning2002, Dec 19, 2015
    #1
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  2. vinces427bb Staff Member

    how is your timing controlled now???
    i figure you are pulling a some timing degrees as the boost goes up??
    i've heard you can make more power with less timing and more boost from the LS-crowd.
    they are running cast/hyper pistons that w/n survive detonation:wideyed:
     
    vinces427bb, Dec 19, 2015
    #2

  3. Lightning2002

    Its controlled by the Ford pcm with a custom tune. The tuner is setup where I can add or subtract 4 degrees timing at three different RPM ranges. This is over the amounts the custom guy put in the tune, I think. The engine is a stock Lightning 5.4l. They have forged pistons but the regular rods of a normal 5.4L. I wanted to data log it to see if its safe to add in any timing. I could add more boost but right now I don't have the extra cash with Christmas and all to spend on another pulley. My wife will cut me off if I put any more money into it until the credit card is paid down!!!
     
    Lightning2002, Dec 20, 2015
    #3

  4. SCF/HAIC Staff Member Admin

    When you datalog knock what you will see is positive or negative numbers showing the amount of retard/advance the computer is adding. If you start seeing retard consistently then it's time to back off a quarter degree at a time until it gets where you want it. Note that by default it's turned off on the Lightning so you won't get any data worth using unless it's been activated in your tune.
     
    SCF/HAIC, Dec 20, 2015
    #4

  5. 06BlownMagnum

    Does the same thing apply with Dodge computers?
     
    06BlownMagnum, Dec 21, 2015
    #5

  6. SCF/HAIC Staff Member Admin

    Not sure, unfortunately. Probably been almost a decade since I've data logged any of them, so I don't remember what the data looked like.
     
    SCF/HAIC, Dec 24, 2015
    #6

  7. 08Foush

    Ken, what about the 2004-2008 F150, can more power be gained by logging knock and adjusting timing?
     
    08Foush, Jan 28, 2016
    #7

  8. SCF/HAIC Staff Member Admin

    Generally, no, not with one of my tunes or one written by someone familiar with these trucks. They've already setup the knock sensor and advance tables to allow the PCM to advance timing if it can.
     
    SCF/HAIC, Jan 29, 2016
    #8

  9. Matt Cramer

    The first rule is, "If more timing doesn't add more power, stop and go to the least amount of timing that makes best power, or 1-2 degrees less." You will also want to listen for knock (we use a Phormula KS Pro for tuning on in house projects - human ears are better at processing analog signals than a computer) and make sure you don't run into the knock limit.
     
    Matt Cramer, Apr 1, 2016
    #9
    vinces427bb likes this.

  10. SBCSupercharged

    How do you know the best power without a dyno? If you tune on the streets would a good knock sensor be okay?
     
    SBCSupercharged, Apr 10, 2016
    #10

  11. vinces427bb Staff Member

    knock sensor wpuld be a plus;
    but checking plugs after increasing timing a couple of degrees on each hit or strip run will tell you;
    if you are seeing flecks of aluminum on the plug tip/porcelain he you will need to drop back
    start with low timing [total] about 18*; then work up from thereo_O
     
    vinces427bb, Apr 10, 2016
    #11

  12. Matt Cramer

    You don't.

    You might be able to get a decent dial in on full throttle with data logging on the dragstrip; see what gives the fastest acceleration a given RPM / gear.
     
    Matt Cramer, Apr 11, 2016
    #12

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